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Post by sc397 on Jul 27, 2018 15:00:00 GMT -8
How far down in the cylinder are those wiseco pistons at tdc? The calculations come up with about .060" in a 343 block. I will see if I can measure one.
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Post by 69Rebel on Jul 27, 2018 15:25:25 GMT -8
Wait a minute. Aren't ya' s'posed to have like .001" quench?
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Post by sc397 on Jul 27, 2018 15:36:44 GMT -8
Wait a minute. Aren't ya' s'posed to have like .001" quench? Sure, why not.. I used to build '70 390's with '71 401 pistons. I will have to do the math but I think they were in the hole like .080" Didn't stop them from roasting tires all day long. I built one for javetwotone and I believe his AMX was in the 12's if I'm not mistaken Don't get me wrong, if I can get near zero deck I will. It is a matter of matching price, application, etc..
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Post by n2ojoe on Jul 27, 2018 15:39:31 GMT -8
I run Wiseco flat top 401 pistons in my 390, .063" in the hole, to get the compression where I wanted. Runs pretty well but does take more timing than a tight quench would. Pretty common practice lately in the heavier nitrous engines though, because it's easier on the head gaskets by letting the cylinder wall absorb more of the heat.
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Post by Captain Awesome on Jul 27, 2018 17:51:31 GMT -8
10 years ago I knew a guy out of Southern New York, he was running high 7s in the 1/4 mile. He would put close to 200 passes a year on his Car. He raced all season, didn't sit on Jackstands all blown up like most around my neck of the Woods. He said he was .080 down the hole. So it used to crack me up when all these 12-13-14 sec guys, who can barely make it out of the driveway, were sweating tight quench and eating up that .015 hype on the Forums years age.
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Post by 67roguexcode on Jul 27, 2018 19:00:41 GMT -8
...but, but, Forrest said...
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Post by spud on Jul 28, 2018 9:12:53 GMT -8
If you build for quench and turbulence it makes more power and needs less timing. Needing less timing alone makes power becuz you are decreasing parasitic losses due to decreasing the cylinder pressure as the piston rises to tdc... fast burn rates put the pressure on the piston when it does the most work
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Post by Captain Awesome on Jul 28, 2018 10:53:58 GMT -8
I wish I would have screen shotted his convo online about Quench. He drove his car on the street and it wasn't some sub 3000lb car either. He went by Big Dog and was like 7' tall 500lbs himself and not fat. He had an aluminum Drag Seat bolted straight to the floor n a Turd Gen Maro, and it was mounted where the backseat was, was how big this dude was. No light weight running there for those times. BBC n2o
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Post by sc397 on Aug 5, 2018 4:31:34 GMT -8
74. RR290: Bone stock 290 for ’66 Rogue Convert. (One of 3 made with a 2bbl and 4spd) This one is pretty cool. The first year for the new "Thin Wall Casting Technique" so there are some small changes in the blocks between 1966 and 1968. I believe when the 390 came out in 1968 is when they changed things to standardize etc. IMG_0194 by Rick Jones, on Flickr No displacement embossment. I assume that all 1966 290 engines were this way and the 290 embossment was added when the 343 came out in 1967. IMG_0195 by Rick Jones, on Flickr This one might take a little extra cleaning.. LOL! IMG_0205 by Rick Jones, on Flickr This the first noticeable difference between the '66 290 and the '68 290, the saddle type main caps. IMG_0200 by Rick Jones, on Flickr 1966-1967 Main cap in front 1968 and latter in rear. IMG_0372 by Rick Jones, on Flickr The Doc and I worked our asses off getting this thing apart. You may notice that the top half of the piston is still in the block. I didn't get a picture but the Doc had to drill a bunch of holes in one of the pistons so that we could brake it out of there. IMG_0209 by Rick Jones, on Flickr IMG_0199 by Rick Jones, on Flickr This baby was really tired. No babbitt at all left on the rod bearings but the crank is actually pretty good and will easily clean up at -.010"/.010". Kinda cool, they have the old AM script on them and are dated 3-66. (See Joe, I am a Dork on this stuff too). IMG_0377 by Rick Jones, on Flickr Another difference. The '66-'67 oil pans and notorious dip stick tube is different than the 1968. The oil pan doesn't have the hole in the baffle for the dip stick tube and the dip stick tube doesn't have the bend in the lower part of it. IMG_0211 by Rick Jones, on Flickr This is one of the very few that had the main bearing oil feed holes drilled all the way through in to the lifter galley. Tells me that they should have all been that way. IMG_0210 by Rick Jones, on Flickr The whole pile is at the machine shop now. To be continued... Update 6-14-19 Finally going together with this one now. Interesting difference in the oil plunger. I had never seen one with the end turned down like that. The head bolts don't have the flange on them either. That was a change or the better. These things had a different feel to them while I was torquing them and it wasn't a good feel. I think that the bolt heads were digging into the cylinder head. I got to 95#/ft and stopped. IMG_1755 by Rick Jones, on Flickr Found the perfect paint match for the gold engine color. IMG_1751 by Rick Jones, on Flickr Update 6-24-19 The oil pump didn't seem quite right when I put it together. It would catch slightly sometimes when you spun the gears by hand. I knew that the shaft was wore but I thought that it would be ok. It ended up being wore a lot more than I thought. It primed up ok but made the 1/2 horse drill grunt a little more than normal. Long story short, I pulled the shaft out and replaced it. Not easy to get to get at and not a easy task. This is the first time that I ever had to do this but it definitely needed replaced. IMG_1812 by Rick Jones, on Flickr It was wore 0.008" on one side. IMG_1813 by Some more wore out parts. Had to install a different set of rocker arms and push rods. IMG_1814 by Rick Jones, on Flickr Update 6-26-19 Well this sucks. Cracked head right behind the first head bolt. Couldn't see it with the naked eye. I checked my bill and this one was machined just before we started magnafluxing for cracks. Great luck. I pulled it off and took it to Sperry Welding in the thumb area of MI which is a 2 1/2 drive from my house. Now I wait until he gets it welded for me and then back to the machinist to put all new valve guides back in it. The vid sounds like crap because of a header leak. IMG_1823 by Rick Jones, on Flickr Update 10-9-19 Well this sucks even more. I got the head welded, new guides put in etc, and as I was torqueing the bolts on the final torque on the corner bolt I heard a little "tink". WTF! I knew what had happened but I finished putting it together anyway in case I was wrong. IMG_2294 by Rick Jones, on Flickr I wasn't wrong, it leaked again. Stuck my head in the TSM's from 1966 through 1968 and found out that there is actually a different head bolt torque spec on the 1966 and 1967 engines. My assumpton is that when the 390 came out in 1968 they changed the head bolts for all of the V8 engines to the flanged type and bumped up the torque. 1966 & 1967 Head Bolt Torque Spec. 72-77 #/ft. (7/16" Head Bolts) IMG_2335 by Rick Jones, on Flickr 1968 & 1969 Head Bolt Torque Spec. 90-100 #/ft. (7/16" Flanged Head Bolts) IMG_2337 by Rick Jones, on Flickr Back to the welder we go.. Update 1-1-20 Look Mom, no leaks! Happy New Year! I cheated a little bit by installing hardened washers under the head bolts to help distribute the load. IMG_2597 by Rick Jones, on Flickr She runs pretty nice. IMG_2594 by Rick Jones, on Flickr With the correct Rich Corsello restored carb. IMG_2599 by Rick Jones, on Flickr Kinda cool that it has the original distributor. I am converting it to Pertronics. IMG_2602 by Rick Jones, on Flickr Date coded 1965. IMG_2603 by Rick Jones, on Flickr
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Post by ramblingrebel on Aug 6, 2018 3:24:06 GMT -8
sorry i missed THIS fun (no i'm not) rr
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Post by sc397 on Aug 6, 2018 4:56:38 GMT -8
sorry i missed THIS fun (no i'm not) rr Well just turn in your Man Card on your way out then. C'mon! Busted bolts, grease and grime, busted knucles, shit flying in your eye, smacking yourself in the hand with a two pound hammer, 52 yeas of nasty crap all over the floor to clean up. It just doesn't get much better than that! The only issue is now I don't have Salmon Boy to clean up the mess for me.
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Post by n2ojoe on Aug 6, 2018 5:17:17 GMT -8
Now THAT sounds like a party!
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Post by PHAT69AMX on Aug 7, 2018 11:09:52 GMT -8
Any "oil grooves" in the front face of the Cam Sprocket? Distributor Gears still look like new? Any other interesting Distributor Oiling details? Grooved bearing or journal on the Cam? Dimension from top of Oil Pump Gear to end of shaft? Depth of Slot? Dimension on Distributor from Housing Gasket face to bottom Drive End? Length of Drive Flat? Known original parts could give some good reference dimensions maybe. Would sure like to see original AMC mechanical drawings of the Distributor / Oil Pump Drive like I've seen of the Engine Block Machining drawing that was posted on the BT forums.
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Post by sc397 on Aug 7, 2018 12:35:32 GMT -8
The timing set was replaced at one time, the original ones with nylon gears had no grooves. The only grooved cam bearing is the front one. The dowel hole is located in a different position between the Duraspark and Delco distributors. I am not sure if the Prestolite is the same as either one but I can check. It is not that critical anyway - the gears are not hypoid type of gears. IMG_0392 by Rick Jones, on Flickr First one that I have seen with extra slots. I guess they wanted some oil at the face of the block. IMG_0391 by Rick Jones, on Flickr Again, this baby is tired.. Video shows how much slop there is. IMG_0386 by Rick Jones, on Flickr I would say normal wear for a engine that has a lot of miles. I will probably replace both with a set of MSD gears. IMG_0390 by Rick Jones, on Flickr
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Post by PHAT69AMX on Aug 21, 2018 13:54:03 GMT -8
A lot of interesting little details in that early 290 like those 2 extra block face timing sprocket oil grooves... and that there are no front side oil grooves. Distributor Gears do shown some wear but what 200k miles ? Thanks for posting all the pictures. Looks like right now Building Addition is top priority while weathers good. Guess it's all right to post the drawing I made of Distributor Gear Oil Path here ? Any one see any glaring errors ?
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